Eben is indispensable

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Nov 14, 2023, 16:03

Of all our older players Eben tops the list as most indispensable player followed by Am and Pollard

I say this as replacements for them have yet to be established

In my opinion Eben is the best lock to ever play the game so to replace him will take some doing. There are some good young locks around as there always are in SA so it’s going to be interesting to see who puts their hand up the highest. Big fan of Jason Jenkins, want to see him invested in moving forward. Others include Moerat, Ruan Vermaak, Ruben Schoeman and Andre Smith.

Pollard showed how vital he is in the WC, we have a more than handy deputy in Libbok, but until he can nail his kicks, question marks remain. Time will tell.

Am at 13 has a few years left in him but we need to unearth a similar player with the same skill and rugby intellect as Am. Kriel was a WC stop gap and did a solid job mostly defensively - we need clout on attack. Thankfully we have seen Moodie get a taste at 13 at test level, that investment needs to continue both at provincial and test level. He is the answer especially once he has added 5kg to his respectable 94kg frame.

Elsewhere we are pretty much covered in terms of younger back ups that have had a taste

At fullback, Willie has already been replaced by Willemse and if not Willemse because he is being employed elsewhere then we have Gelant and Fassi

On the wing, Mapimpi has already been replaced by Arendse and hopefully we see the return of the impressive Nkosi who is only 27.

At inside centre, de Allende can be replaced by Esterhuizen, who at 29 has a few years left in him but we also need to be identifying a younger player as his back up. Again Willemse could feature here. We also need to get Rickus Pretorious back from Japan

At scrumhalf Faf and Reinach have a handful of worthy young candidates to replace them, headed by Williams and followed by Hendrikse, Jantjies, Papier, Nohamba and Burger

At loosehead Kitshoff is easily replaced by Ox who deserves and extended run as a starter. The impressive Gerhard Steenkamp is a handy back up.

At hooker, Bongi as Marx’s backup can be replaced by Dweba or Grobelaar or Venter or Kotze

At tighthead Malherbe, Koch and Nyakane can be replaced by Thomas du Toit and Wilco Louw

At 5, Lood and Mostert should have already been replaced by the incredibly impressive RG Snyman, with Ruben v Heerden looking very good for the Stormers

At openside Kolisi could be replaced by Kwagga but unfortunately Kwagga is already 30. I’m a big fan of Buthelezi playing 6, not your traditional 6 but more of a Kolisi type. We don’t really have a young out and out fetcher coming through.

At blindside, PSDT could be replaced by JL du Preez or Ruan Venter or Vincent Tsituka or Ben Jason-Dixon

At 8, Vermeulen needs to be replaced by one of Roos, Wiese, Dan du Preez, Emmanuel Tsituka or Hanekom

All our bases seemed to be covered we just need to make sure these youngsters are introduced and invested in sooner than later

Nov 14, 2023, 16:54

Completely agree about Etzebeth….a giant of the game. As you know I don’t rate all those youngsters, but given the age of our team we need to transition early in the next 4 year cycle. The trick will be to maintain enough continuity to not tank our results for 2 years.

Nov 14, 2023, 17:23

Spot on Moz and the way to do that is work towards a side in the next year that resembles something along the lines of:

15. Willemse

14. Kolbe

13. Am

12. Esterhuizen

11. Arendse

10. Pollard

9. Williams

1. Ox

2. Marx

3. Thomas du Toit

4. Etzebeth

5. RG Snyman

6. Kolisi


8. Roos

16. Dweba 17. Steenkamp 18. Wilco Louw 19. Jenkins 20. Kwagga 21. Hendrikse 22. Libbok 23. Moodie

Thereafter it’s a case of phasing out Kolisi, PSDT, Eben and potentially Esterhuizen. Am, Kolbe and Pollard before the next WC if need be. I’m guessing Pollard at 10 could make another WC but time will tell.

Ultimately we need to concentrate on the now with an eye on the future. More Bok A side fixtures are needed and the youngsters need to be picked against the lesser sides like Italy and Argentina

Nov 14, 2023, 17:46

Good post, Even is the modern version of Bakkies Botha. If that guy played today he would be the biggest villain and wouldn't get near a bok jersey with all the bans. 

Eben from a young age was holding his own and dominating. He also have been able to control that aggression up to the right point. 

He could make 35 but we see how players dip past 32, unless you are Deon Fourie. Even old Vermeulen made it up to 37. At lock, I think Eben could play for another 4 years if we manage him well, 

I haven't seen any lock come close to him

Nov 14, 2023, 17:48

Agree with Moz on the phasing out. We probably want to setup next season as a swan song for some, maybe Kolisi, Kwagga can hang around. De Allende should hand over the reigns now and we need to get more test under Esterhuizen. 

Nkosi needs to sort out his mental problems, social media fame and the rest is getting to him now. 

Nov 14, 2023, 18:58

I think the process is simple really - you stick with your side until individual players start to dip in form as they get older

But at the same time you need to identify younger replacements and invest in them, thereby ensuring a smooth transition of new player for old.

Rassie is sometimes too loyal to his older players as we saw with Frans Steyn - he was long past his sell by date while still being capped for the Boks

Rassie needs to be more vigilant in this respect

Eye on the future:

15. Fassi 14. Tambwe 13. Moodie 12. David Kriel 11. Green 10. Sacha 9. Nohamba 1. Steenkamp 2. Grobelaar 3. Sadie 4. Moerat 5. Ruben v Heerden 6. Buthelezi 7. Ruan Venter 8. Elrigh Louw

16. Venter 17. Mchunu 18. Klopper 19. Ruan Vermaak 20. Emmanuel Tsituka 21. Burger 22. Hendrikse 23. Rickus Pretorious

Nov 14, 2023, 22:35

True, the young guys need to put their hands ups and fight for a spot. If he is good enough he is old enough, not matter if he is 37 or 20. 

Willemse and Willie was a good switch. I do believe having the older players on the field help us in those close games.

I think Rassie said that scrum penalty against Oz when cooper got that kick over was down to inexperienced players not knowing how to close out a game. And how did the experience players prove in our last 3 games how you play the game out. The boks stop scoring after 36 min and then only had 7 points to defend. Crazy come to think about it. 

My only question, if you could 5, who would be the guys you want there? 

  1. Etzebeth
  2. Marx
  3. PSDT
  4. Pollard
  5. Am 
These are the senior guys I want to see there. 

Then the top youngsters under 23 they I would like to see get a crack

  1. Hendrikse
  2. Moodie
  3. Roos
We have some players that could form the core who are 26 now.
  1. Willemse 
  2. Ox
  3. Steenkamp
  4. Grobbler
  5. Van Staden 
  6. Arendse 
  7. Williams 
  8. Jean Luc 
My only concern with holding to some of the older guys is that the younger guys won't get enough caps or experience to shut down a game. 

Next year will be massive. 

Ireland 3 test series at home. 

Championship with Scot Robertson as the coach 

Nov 14, 2023, 23:03

Willemse is 25, JL du Preez is 28

Yeah we need to beat the Irish 3-0 as payback

Nov 15, 2023, 15:42

I fear that AM is at the crossroards at this at this stage of his career.

But agree with most of your other selection Kingcorn.

The two present wingers should also be include as well as the Lions fly-half Hendrikse.

Brother to the scrumhalf Hendrikse.

Nov 16, 2023, 12:13

It’s very unlikely that The Du Preez brothers will be selected for the Boks….Rassie would have picked them already…we have very good loosies to pick from, right here in SA….Eben is one of a kind and we do have other good locks, but they don’t have what Etzebeth does….Ruben van Heerden and Adri smith will be my pick…then also Jasper Wiese,s brother Cobus Wiese ( 26 Years old ) is a guy that I would like to see in a Springbok Jersey.

Nov 16, 2023, 12:24

Wilco is a way better Tighthead than tank….also less penalty prone…Thomas is better at Loosehead.

Nov 16, 2023, 12:27

Bullshit on Thomas at tighthead he was awesome there for the Sharks

Nov 16, 2023, 12:37

Nah disagree….Thomas has never been started in that Position by Rassie…Wilco is like Frans a genuine TH Prop.

Nov 16, 2023, 15:29

You have no idea what you are talking about

The Sharks frontrow of Ox, Bongi and Thomas were very dominant

Stop making this shit up - Thomas has not played loosehead in about 3 seasons

Nov 16, 2023, 17:51

I don’t make shit up…I just have a different view point that’s all…in what world do you live where you think your viewpoint is like the beginning and the end and everyone else's is Nonsense?? That is quite arrogant…News flash Buddy, a Broken Clock also tells the Correct time twice a day …I have seen with my own eyes how Tank has been under immense pressure at TH….but put him at Loosehead, where he has played most of his career, he does much better….The Bok Front Row must be 1. Thomas 2. Grobbelaar 3. Wilco…Ende : )

Nov 16, 2023, 18:36

You are fucking rugby ignorant telling us Thomas is no good at tighthead - what is that based on your fucking eyes?

If so get some fucking glasses

Just because Rassie selected Thomas at 1 after 3 seasons of playing 3 does not mean he is playing 1 you fucking idiot

You know fuck all about rugby

Nov 16, 2023, 19:11

Go fuck yourself dave!!…Arrogant prick…up stream merchant my ass, you are a rude Horror of human being!

Nov 16, 2023, 19:15

And you remain a fucking ignorant rugby fool

Thomas is weak at tighthead - what a load of utter fucking crap

How the fuck did the Sharks scrum dominate like it did with a weak tighthead huh?

Fucking idiot - get a pair of glasses

Nov 16, 2023, 19:26

I rather be Rugby Fool, then a arrogant prick that thinks the Sun shines out his ass…Fuck off and go suck a dick!!

Nov 16, 2023, 19:35

Why would a rugby fool post on a rugby board?

Go find a fucking darts board to post on

Suck dick? How very grown up of you

So you are both stupid and childish?

Poor fucker

Nov 16, 2023, 19:39

: )

Nov 16, 2023, 19:49

I still love you brother don’t worry

Nov 16, 2023, 19:57

Play nice, David…..

Nov 16, 2023, 20:01

Nah Dave, you are like Rassie….you only love yourself on this Forum….but you go ahead and have yourself a lovely eve there in ENG.

Nov 16, 2023, 20:04

So Rassie does not love his players in your opinion?

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